Des van Rooyen ‘did not know advisor’s name’, says Fuzile

This is after Van Rooyen attempted to force Treasury to hire two other people, without following due procedure, after he was sworn in as the finance minister in 2015.

Former director-general at Treasury, Lungisa Fuzile, detailed the chaotic few days of Van Rooyen’s tenure during his second day of testimony on Thursday.

Fuzile told the commission that he soon realised that Van Rooyen did not know his advisor’s name, nor the position he would assume during a meet-and-greet with senior staff. 

“During the introductions, it became apparent that Mr van Rooyen was not fully familiar with the two gentleman nor the specific roles that he wanted them to play, as they had to correct him on their names and their new positions.

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“I recall that he said Mr Mohamed Bhobat had to be chief of staff and Bhobat had to correct him and say he would be the advisor.”

Bhobat had earlier introduced himself to Fuzile, on the day van Rooyen was sworn in as the finance minister.

He introduced himself as Van Rooyen’s new advisor.  

“At that point it had become very clear to me that a lot of what (chairperson of the ANC's subcommittee on economic transformation) Enoch Godongwane had said, had been confirmed. It’s not like I was making inferences, he said he would come with advisors given to me,” said Fuzile.

Beginning his testimony on Wednesday, Fuzile told the commission that Godongwane had called him after Nene was fired, telling him that he would receive a “Gupta Minister” and advisors.

Another gentleman introduced to Fuzile was Malcolm Mabaso.

Mabaso was also an employee at the Department of Mineral Resources and has subsequently been implicated in the Gupta leaks.

Fuzile believes that Mabaso was key in helping the Guptas capture Treasury, as the Department of Mineral Resources was also in the process of being captured.

“I make the point that I learned later, that soon after I had seen Mr Mabaso, he had been at the Department of Mineral Resources at that time. What then that suggested to me is that one of the reasons why Mr van Rooyen had emphasised was there be no need to capture his details on Perisal, which is one system for the rest of government.

“So in a way, I can say now that it wasn’t possible that as Treasury we could appoint him at Treasury while he was at DMR.”

Fuzile said he believes that Mabaso was a key player in the attempts to capture Treasury.

“It occurred to me now, when I connect the many things, but if you go back to the conversation with Mr Godongwane who asked me to talk to Mr Thibedi Ramontja who was the DG at DMR; he was suggesting that maybe what was going to happen to Treasury had happened already at the DMR. Dr Ramontja was probably going to share with me what transpires when a department is being captured,” said Fuzile